A Climate Change with Matt Matern Climate Podcast

This year, we actually achieved number two nationally, number four globally in sustainability ranking. Sustainability really needs to be a part of how we think and how we solve problems. I started as a sustainable development goals project officer, actually at Griffith University. I could answer that question, but I better not.

Thanks, Patricia. I just wanted to ask you a little bit about your position at Griffith University, and what are the types of things that you’re doing there.

Yeah, absolutely, so very happy to be there. You have to know that I did actually my masters at Griffith University in Brisbane. So that’s how I came from Mexico with a scholarship to do that, and so it was really for a long time, as I was saying, Before, my passion being education, environment and all of that, really, one of my dreams was to work in a university. So when I really got into that role, it was one of the best news ever for me.

So I started at the Sustainable Development Goals project officer actually at Griffith University, so working with the sustainability team there, and that eventually led me to so at the beginning, I was working in sort of like embedding the sustainable development goals within the university in all areas. And then my position became more, a little bit more all over the place with like so, not only SDG implementation, but also, you know, sustainability initiatives and things like that. And so that position led to becoming the sustainability project officer. And so as in that role, what I do is I coordinate projects to deliver initiatives on their Griffith sustainable strategy and then as well.

So I work in the academic and engagement governance pillars of the of the university, but I also focus on some of the engagement when it comes to operations initiatives as well. So it’s a little bit like at the beginning, I was saying the multidisciplinary. And as you know, in sustainability, it’s all about interconnection. So it’s really a lot of of work done in different areas. Not only sustainability or environmental operations is really engagement, it’s communications, is a little bit of everything.

So yeah, that’s, that’s what I’ve been doing there, and really trying my best to embed sustainability within the university, and that includes, you know, not only courses, but also culture. It’s really interesting, yeah.

So tell us what has you’ve been able to move the needle in terms of results and and measuring the results at the university, and how that has made a difference and an impact at Griffith University.

Yeah. So absolutely, it’s been, it’s been a team effort. So we have four people, five people in the team. Griffith University is very lucky to have a dean in sustainability, actually, and a lot of the work has been done due to the ranking. So we are part of the Higher Education impact rankings when it comes to sustainability. And the great news is that this year, we actually achieved number two nationally, number four globally in sustainability rankings. And as well, we achieved number one in particular, SDGs.

So it’s been really great news this year for us, but that comes with a lot of effort from not only the members of the sustainability team, but as well as they, you know, all of the staff members, the community, the academics, the researchers who really share with us all of the achievements that they have within their research. And we were able to use that as data for the sustainability impact rankings. And it’s been fantastic. It’s just a collaborative effort. It’s really a community effort.

So that’s the beauty of sustainability, isn’t it, that you’re really a part of a community effort, and you work together towards a goal. So yeah, it wouldn’t be possible without the team, but it’s all it’s also possible because of the great effort that the university has been putting on becoming more sustainable and achieving the sustainability goals they have.

So in terms of achieving those goals, what does that look like in terms of reduction in carbon footprint, reduction in waste, a reduction in energy getting energy from renewable sources, what are the metrics that make you in the top 10 schools around the world. What are the things that they’re looking at to score that?

So yeah, it’s actually the work, the great work of, for example, the facilities management and operations at Griffith University, who are looking into really having more opportunities when it comes to having renewables in the university, as well as working on solar panels, installations, things like that. We are actually working on our climate action plan this year, which will be released later this year. We’re also working on a waste management plan later this year. We have now a water management plan as well.

Well. So it’s really putting all those efforts together and working, not only, like I said, within sustainability team, but also collaborating with campus operations and really looking at the best way of achieving the sustainable sustainability goals. But we do a lot as well with our climate action beacon, so they have initiatives in place and and then we put it all together and see, you know what the goals of the university are, which we want to become.

I think it’s carbon neutral by 20, by 2029, and so it’s really, it’s, it’s very ambitious goal, but we’re trying our best to, you know, get there. And there’s a lot of work being done in universities across Australia to do that. So, you know, we work with other universities as well and share a lot of the knowledge that we have. You know, what is working for some, what is not working for others? Yeah, that’s, that’s what I can share from that area.

Well, it’s really a worthy goal to be reaching for carbon neutrality by 2029 and that would be in advance of where most organizations are looking at so maybe you can tell us some of the initiatives that have been most successful, that Griffith University has used to make progress in that on that goal.

Yeah, so one of the things that they’ve been doing really well is really trying to align leadership and institutional priorities with the long term sustainability and so in particular when it comes to sustainability education. So going back to that, we’re trying to do a lot of initiatives that really involve the community. So for example, I know that sustainability is seen sometimes not that important, but Griffith is really given a priority to it, especially now, leaders are really balancing, like every other institution around the world because of the recent environment.

As you know, we’re trying to balance financial pressures and political timelines and but once that you really understand that education for sustainability requires a system level shift, it’s really when you start seeing the changes along the whole system. So yeah, it’s been really interesting. We do some initiatives when it comes to engagement with students. For example, we also do we’re trying to embed sustainability in the curriculum, so that we do a lot of work with the academics in that area. We’re coming together with we have a sustainability community of practice. So it’s over 100 members, and those members really work together in initiatives.

So we have an A Sustainable Development Goals roadmap in that plan is actually sort of like the leading document that is taking us to bring all these initiatives together and see in different areas, in different schools, what are the initiatives that we need to implement to really engage students and staff in sustainability. So a lot, a lot of that is, is really education for sustainability. As you know, we all have different positions within the university, so it’s not really a priority for all of the roles, but it’s really important that we are in the same sort of place when it comes to aligning the goals of the university, when it comes to sustainability and understanding why that is important.

So yeah, we have lots of initiatives going on right now. So for example, one of them, I can tell you, it’s called yearning for sustainability, which we’re trying to implement next year. And this one is about really bringing back the Indigenous Knowledges here in Australia, and really integrating that knowledge with sustainability, with the students. So that is one of them. We’re also planning a research an SDG research summit later in the year. We’re having a waste management campaign. We’re trying to really get involved with students, which, by the way, right now is not easy. Our students are really busy.

They’re really having a different different priorities and balancing different things. A lot of our students work full, part time, so that’s really interesting as well. So engagement, it’s it’s sometimes challenging, but, but I think we’re doing pretty good and and we’re really lucky to have professional staff and academics also trying to work with us to achieve that.

So in terms of working with the indigenous community, what are the practices and that you’re using to incorporate into the work at the university?

So Griffin University has a DBCI, a Deputy Vice Chancellor in Indigenous, and so they have a special team that is really working. And that work actually started before sustainability started to be embedded in the university. Griffin University has been doing this since the 70s. It was a university that started with that focus on the environment. It was one of the first universities in Australia that had that that focus. And so I think later on, they really try to embed Indigenous Knowledges within the curriculum.

And there. Really achieved something incredible. So you have all of the academics now really aware of how to integrate these knowledges in the curriculum, and we do have practices and initiatives and activities that really involve not only the staff but the university students in these practices and really putting At the front the importance of Indigenous Knowledges within the university. So we, as part of that, we thought, you know, the way that they’ve been doing it, that team, it’s fantastic.

They’ve achieved so much. So they’re really looking into the alignment of everything and how everyone gets, to understand why it is important, and what is the meaning behind integrating Indigenous Knowledges. And so we’ve been wanting to do that as well when it comes to sustainability. So really getting to that place where everyone understands, why is it that we’re doing, why it is important, and what the direction we can take. And so yes, part of that, I think the work being done as Griffith with Griffith University in that area has been phenomenal.

So it’s interesting that some of the things that you’re talking about in terms of collaboration between departments and all kinds of different people at the university, kind of sounds like one of the guests that I just I interviewed recently, Dr Beth sawen, who’s the founder and director of the multi solving Institute, and she’s an author of a book, multi solving, creating system change in a fractured world, and talks about how having many different stakeholders be involved in the process of achieving these environmental goals.

And some of them coming from maybe a health perspective, saying, hey, trying to clean our air has some health benefits, and others coming from different angles, but ultimately, getting lots of people engaged in The process. And so maybe you can talk about how that has worked for you.

Yeah, it’s fun. It’s one of my favorite parts of sustainability, actually the work in sustainability, because so in terms, for example, if you add education for sustainability, which is really what I really love in my passion, I really think that this is a transformative sort of whole institution approach to sustainability, particularly in higher education. This is something that other universities are trying to do as well. So, and I think it’s, it’s, it’s an incredible opportunity for the universities to do this and really lead systemic change.

So that means not really just teaching sustainability, but embedding it into their governance and their operations and the research and partnerships and also the engagement with the community. So I feel like part of this integration of and being multidisciplinary of sustainability brings a really rich sort of knowledges and integrates them into the university, because you’re not only talking about environmental science or sustainability practice, sustainable practice, but you’re also talking about what other areas within the university can align, how they can align better to really integrate all the knowledge and go towards one goal.

In this case, sustainable, sustainable sustainability and sustainable goals, sustainable goals. But yeah, so it’s like, I tell students, for example, is whether you’re studying law, design, business or health, engineering, sustainability really needs to be a part of how we think and how we solve problems and make decisions.

So that multidisciplinary, really, when well done, it really helps, for example, the students to understand how complex the problems that we face are right now, and so how they interconnect, as well in this collaborative process, as well in the cross sector solutions that we see with partnerships. For example, external partnerships are really a really great and need to be a part of it. So I think another area of impact, if we talk about impact, for example, is, is how institutions are now embracing new indicators, for example.

So refit is really working in graduate readiness. So how the how can a graduate country contribute better to the SDGs, you know, what is the community impact that we have, and really the cultivation of the values that’s a really important thing for Griffith. The values is a values based institution, university. So values like empathy, stewardship, equity, things like that are really something that will reflect the deeper commitment that the university has, and it will be, not only reflected in the workforce, hopefully, but but also in the in the community.

You know, as a community, how it works. But I feel that, yes, that that interconnection and that interdisciplinarity coming, bringing everything together is something that will lead us to. Up to success, and I feel like a lot of organizations need that as well. It’s sort of like a new shift that we’re going towards. Yeah.

So what innovative approaches have you found most effective in engaging communities and organizations with sustainability, education?

I think that digital innovation is really shaping the space. What excites me the most is really the use of technology, not just for the content delivery, obviously, but, you know, like for connection and co creation, which is really important in sustainability and really also global learning exchanges for for students. That’s another, another part, another important part of the process. So we’re really seeing networks of students that are working together, cross borders, really to support one another in terms of achieving that kind of global citizenship and learning more about systems thinking.

And it’s exactly what we need more of, in my opinion, at least, I think that we see growing momentum as well behind student led and community partner sustainability initiatives, which often really serve as powerful living laboratories for change. So that’s another that’s another thing that we’re looking at really working in a university and making in a living laboratory where students can work in initiatives and projects, and treat them as a real world challenges and how they would do it in the real world setting.

So these spaces really allow students to experience, you know, experiential learning and in really share leadership and really experiencing innovation from the ground up, which can often spark change faster than top down models, for example. But yeah, I feel like if thinking about again education for sustainability is really thinking about culture. So it’s really about thinking how we are defining knowledge, how we learn from, who we learn from, and in what we kind of world we are really working together to build. But I think, yeah, I think that’s where real transformation happens. That’s that. I think it’s what, what I believe the best in the most important impact will be made.

Yeah, so you’ve had experience in both business and environmental sustainability. How do you think businesses can better integrate sustainability practices through education?

That’s such an important question, and it’s a long one, but I think so. Yeah, business has an incredible potential to be a force for change, as we all know, but I believe it really requires a shift in the mindset, and I think that’s when education becomes really big part of it. In my experience, one of the most effective ways that businesses can integrate sustainability is by embedding learning into the culture of the organization, again, just like the university.

So it’s not really just a one off training session and really educating staff members about sustainability, but it’s really a long ongoing process of really reflecting and coming together to upskill and allow focus future focused thinking. So education, I think, helps businesses move from a reactive, or let’s say, compliance based approach to a strategic and values driven one.

So that’s something that we’re looking into as a university. So for example, in the Griffith business school, they really have succeed in integrated, succeeded in integrated the Sustainable Development Goals, in embedding sustainability in it. So now you will have students, for example, coming out of business degrees that know exactly what the SDGs are and what the focus of the SDGs are and why they’re important.

So I feel like when going back to businesses, when you really as a business, work to make sustainability part of internal professional development, so staff across departments, not just ESG or not just sustainability roles, when they are in power with the knowledge and the tools that they need to make the decisions that consider not only social but environmental and economic impacts, that’s when really the innovation starts, and when businesses begin to think systemically in understanding the role within a bigger picture.

Okay, so what are some of the biggest challenges you’ve encountered in promoting education, sustainability, and how have you overcome them?

Yes, so it’s not an easy one to answer to just because yes, there’s as in anything else, there’s a lot of challenges when it comes to implementing sustainability and embedding sustainability, but I think one of the biggest challenges, in my opinion, is again, aligning leadership and institutional priorities with a big, long term vision of sustainability. Yes. So I think often sustainability, like I said before, is in. As as important, but not really urgent, which in this case, it is especially when leaders are balancing different priorities.

So I think whenever we we really focus on having a system level shift for sustainability, it can be difficult when decisions makers, decision makers are really busy with all the things and priorities, like I said, but I think when there’s a willingness to rethink business as usual, and understandably, not everyone feels equipped or empowered to make that shift, but when that shift happens, it’s really when you start seeing the results. So even research back this.

So for example, there’s studies by the United Nations Educational, Scientific cultural organizations, or UNESCO and other really global education bodies consistently have really highlighted that lack of support and initial institutional support and leadership in this really has been a major, a major barrier to embedding Sustainability meaningful across curricula and organizational strategies.

So I think that for overcoming challenges like this is really essential to frame sustainability not as an add on, but just as something that supports core institutional goals. So whether you know that’s innovation or if it’s a student engagement or reputation or long term resilience, I think really focusing on sharing language and shared value, helping leadership teams see how sustainability education contributes to the bigger picture is really a major step towards achieving sustainability. And another strategy, I think, is that has been effective is the use of evidence and storytelling together.

So in a way, you realize that when you work with researchers, that helps a lot, showing progress and impact and but stories. You know, when you do storytelling, it’s really when the stories come to life. So for example, sharing the positive experiences of educators, of the students or the communities who are already doing this work in meaningful ways. It really helps. The first session from this is a challenge to this is already being done, so we can do it as well.

So, but I really think that patience and resistance are key. Change is, as you know, never easy when it all happens at once. So I think celebrating the small wins is important, and having that consistency and advocacy and in really building alliances across different teams or departments, like we were saying before, it’s really a great way to create momentum.

And so I think the most rewarding part of all of this is when, when you see that leadership really aligns. That’s when the commitment really creates all the ripple effect across the entire organization or businesses, depending on where you are. So it creates spaces for innovation, deeper engagement, and ultimately, a more meaningful connection between education and sustainability.

If you could take one piece of advice, or if you could give one piece of advice to schools that want to take action on climate education, but don’t know where to start, what would it be?

I think the first one would be, start with what you have, where you are, and find your champions and really focus on what matters to your learners, so you don’t really need to wait for a perfect curriculum or leadership support, like we were saying before, to begin waving sustainability into your area of teach or your teaching. It’s really some of the most impactful sustainability education, I’ve seen from passionate educators, it’s been really how they work together, with very limited resources, but with a really deep commitment to empower their students. And then the students actually are the ones that start advocating for sustainability.

So in communities, for example, with schools, if we talk about elementary schools when sustainability isn’t yet a priority, I think it helps connect the learning to the local issues and lived experiences. So again, storytelling. So sustainability isn’t just about you know, what we see in the media, so polar birds and global treaties is it’s really about things that matter to all of us.

So it’s about food, water, transport, housing, health, justice. It’s really about how we live. You know, what we value and what really, what kind of future we want to see. So if students can really see how these ideas relate to their community, to their culture and their daily lives, I think engagement naturally flows and another.

Another piece of advice is embedding sustainability across what you are already teaching, so you don’t really have to create something new, because sustainability really links beautifully with science, with geography, with history, with literature and even maths. And the arts. We have students in arts right now in the university who are doing their thesis and sustainability, and they, you know, they’re students that are working in theater with sustainability, which is, you know, put in plays that really sort of show how, that’s how the society is willing to move towards sustainability, things like that.

And and so it’s, it’s really about perspective and bringing system thinking, ethical reflection, and in really world, problem solving skills to the students in the last one would be understanding that teachers are not alone, like there’s really a growing global community of educators that are committing to sustainability, and there, you know, are open resources, toolkits offered by universities around the world and networks out there as well that are keen to support other teachers.

So I think, yeah, that those would be my recommendations or the advice that I could give. But also, don’t underestimate your influence, like even small actions that you do, you know, asking different questions, introducing new lens, inviting students to imagine alternative futures, can really spark transformation within schools. So teachers, they have such a beautiful, fantastic role, because they can really be the spark that helps students see themselves as someone who care about the world and really act with purpose. Yeah, I think that’s the heart actually, of environmental environmental sustainability in education for sustainability.

So we all know sustainability is crucial. But what’s one small action that you think the people normally overlook that could actually have a big impact on our planet.

I think, is really looking, look sustainability as you know, it has so many definitions. We could define it as they have defined it like the UN has defined it. But I think sustainability means something different from all of us, for all of us, and I think you are the one that is going to define how sustainable you are. So if you think about really going through your day and understanding the impact that you have in all your actions, right? And it’s really like I was saying before, it’s about having empathy and really thinking and reflecting on who you are and what you’re doing towards achieving the goals that we want to achieve for the planet, I think it’s just really looking at that, like looking at all of your actions like, you know, is it really, are you having an impact? What way, in what way your impact is affecting others?

And it’s really about the values and thinking of, you know what? It’s not only you that lives in the planet is also on so many other, so many, so many other people and so many other cultures that are also going, you know, in taking care of the, sorry, I want to start that over again. Yes, I was saying, I feel like, if we reflect on what we do and how we do it, and the impact of our over actions, that’s when you realize, okay, so I am having an impact bigger than just my life, is other lives as well that you put in there.

So I think just reflect on that, reflect on what you’re doing when you wake up, you know, what? What is the tea that you’re having? How are you going to get to school? How are you going to get to work? Are you really thinking it? Are you can you take, you know, public transport is there, are there any other ways where you can make this easier and more sustainable? So it’s really reflecting on your actions and how you’re doing it. It went to what you want to achieve.

Well, absolutely, each of us has a role to play, and we’re playing that role every single day, every single minute of the day, there are options for us to improve our actions and to make more sustainable choices. So, you know, every dollar that we spend is a vote. That’s what Cesar Chavez said. I think it’s, it’s a good phrase.

It keeps us more conscious to what impact we’re having and and we as consumers can change the market by what choices we make and the choices that we don’t make. So Patricia, great having you on the program, I really appreciate the work that you’re doing there in Australia at Griffith University as sustainability project. Officer, keep up the great work, and we’ll look forward to collaborating with you going forward. Thanks for being on the show.

Thank you, Matt, thank you for inviting me. Thank you for having me. Really appreciate it.

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