A Climate Change with Matt Matern Climate Podcast

I think a lot of people get it kind of, sort of now in the environmental space that indigenous peoples, or, you know, marginalized people should have a seat at the table. And now we’re at the next phase of not only do we need a seat at the table, we need to make sure that people actually have a voice and decision making power.

You’re listening to A Climate Change, this is Matt Matern, your host. I’ve got a great guest on the program this week, Leah Thomas. Leah goes by the name of green girl on Instagram, so you can find her there. She wrote the book The intersectional environmentalist. She’s working on a new book, Earth as mother, coming out in March of 2027, and has done a tremendous amount of other stuff. We’ll jump into one of them is a podcast As She Rises, which was, I think, out in October of 2025, so welcome to the program, Leah.

Thanks for having me. Excited to be here.

So tell us a little bit about your story. As far as how did you get, you know, interested in the environmental movement?

Yeah, I would say I was born and raised in the Midwest, a little outside of St Louis, Missouri. So a lot of my childhood really was spent like running around, catching toads, like digging holes, and just living a very Midwestern life. But I never really thought I was an environmentalist. I never really heard that word. I didn’t really go hiking or anything like that. So I just knew being outside was something that I enjoyed. And I guess that’s really all you need to do to be an environmentalist.

Or, you know, even if you’re living in an urban environment, like if you go for a walk, you could technically be an environmentalist. But I didn’t really know that at the time, and still, until I started studying environmental science when I was in school and when I was in college, this was kind of the beginning of, like, the racial justice movement that was happening across the United States, the Black Lives Matter movement, and I really felt like a piece of the racial justice conversation was missing, like ensuring that everybody had access to clean air, clean water and a safe and healthy living environment.

So I feel like I got into environmentalism by way of caring about equality and equity, and I just kept thinking like, oh, what would it look like in my college brain if everybody had access to clean air, clean water and to frolic around in nature, maybe all of our horrible problems wouldn’t be here any longer. Obviously, that is a bit of a stretch, but that’s what got me started on my environmental journey. And I just really hopped in.

I did everything from being a, you know, National Park Service Ranger intern to working in corporate sustainability at companies like Patagonia. And then I became a content creator, and really just fell in love with everything that had to do with the environment right after college, or, I guess, a year after, I got a job as an assistant at Patagonia headquarters, and I was an assistant to Rick Ridgway and a man named Vincent Stanley, who is their director of philosophy.

And essentially, at the time, I was kind of just this very bright eyed 22 or 23 year old that didn’t know much about Patagonia. Puffer jackets. Never owned one one day in my life. But then I was working with this like climbing legend, who was the first American to summit k2 and then also working with, you know, the founder of Patagonia’s nephew, their director of philosophy as a personal assistant.

So I’m so grateful for that experience, because I met these really cool dudes who started this amazing company that was rooted in sustainability. So I saw what was possible. I thought it was so cool. They had a company that had on site childcare, and we had a chiropractor benefit and a massage benefit. And, you know, we would go to protest sometimes on our lunch break, or we would skip work all together. And I took a bus up to San Francisco at 4am with my colleagues to go protest in San Francisco about the environment.

So I’m really grateful that was an experience that I had so soon after college, because I saw what was possible, and that’s what led me to, even, you know, leaving Patagonia and starting my own thing, intersectional environmentalist as a nonprofit, because I saw what could happen when, you I don’t know, thought, think that maybe things could be a little bit better, and I wanted to live in, you know, their example, and try to start my own thing.

So I don’t know, I had a really amazing time working at Patagonia, and I thought I was going to be there for the rest of my life. But I think because I worked there with these people who went, you know, against the status quo. I told my boss, I’m like, I’m leaving because I have to, because this is what you taught me to do. You taught me to shake some stuff up. And it seems like now is the time to talk to people a little bit more about environment and equity. And I want to see how I can, I don’t, know, create my own dream workplace or something like that. So I. I started writing books like the intersectional environmentalists and also built out IE as a nonprofit.

That’s great. Well, it’s, it’s great that you landed at such an amazing company like Patagonia, which, for those who may not know, the founder has, I think, dedicated pretty much all of the the shares and money coming out of Patagonia to environmental causes, so that it’s very noteworthy and exceptional as a philanthropist and somebody who’s looking out for the planet. So where did you go to next after you started your own thing?

Yeah, so I started ie, the nonprofit, which, again, I was, I’m 30 now, almost 31 and I think I was 25 at the time. So I really, wow, there’s a lot of life to live and lessons to learn. But I started it as a 25 year old would do on Instagram, and it was just so crazy that I was posting about environmentalism, and specifically the intersections of social issues and environmentalism. And there were 1000s of people online that were saying, oh, okay, I want to learn about this.

Where are the resources? So a bunch of other 20 something year olds around the country, you know, started creating social media graphics about every topic, from fashion to infrastructure to, you know, farming, and showing people the connection between a specific environmental issue and then the communities that might be impacting, et cetera. And the whole goal, really, at the heart of it, was to help reshape environmental education to make sure that people would ask the question, who, in addition to the what, because I feel like in a lot of environmental spaces, we know the what of a particular environmental issue. We might know there’s pollution in a waterway, or pollution in the air, or there’s a specific problem we’re trying to solve, but sometimes we don’t ask the question, who like, Who is this impacting? Are there low income communities? Are there fishermen who depend on this polluted waterway? Are there indigenous communities, etc?

So that’s all I really wanted to do, and it’s been really fun, you know, doing IE and everything like that. And then since, I guess, the last year or so, I’ve just been on the board and I started a Crafting Club, and I’m also just reconnecting with other things that I also really care about when it comes to sustainability. So I’ve been crafting, and I’m working on a second book called Earth is mother. But yeah, we’ve created over 1000 resources since 2020 on intersectional environmentalist. And, yeah, I’m really excited to have this new journey as a board member.

Well, I was checking out a little bit of your stuff on Instagram, and I was noticing, you know, there was a lot of stuff about thrift stores and trying to encourage people to buy things that aren’t fast fashion and and some commentary about the challenges or the problems that fast fashion creates. And I would imagine that, yeah, we need kind of a cultural shift in that area so that people aren’t just buying cheap stuff and more and more and more, versus maybe reusing the stuff we already have.

Absolutely and I think I am trying to show up in a way where people feel like they’re not being shamed. I think for a really long time in the environmental space, people were maybe shamed for not making certain decisions, not having an electric car, not having $100 beautiful glass Tupperware that you can get on goop. I love goop, but there’s a lot of shame, and especially right now, I think I don’t want people to think that the environmental movement is all about restriction, punishment, shame, or sacrificing yourself so you can get the carbon out of the atmosphere. And until that’s done, we’re not allowed to be happy.

So I do think I am intentionally trying to appeal to people with things that they care about, like sometimes I’ll talk about my cats, and then maybe I’ll segue into talking about, I don’t know the oceans, and there’s microplastics in there, and, like, I don’t know, I’ll find whatever avenue I can to get to people, and sometimes that’s through fashion and again, not wanting to shame people, and sometimes make things a little bit, you know, funny and whimsical. So I’ve been having a lot of fun on social media lately.

Yeah, I kind of like that one post you had where you took an older top that you had and you put a bunch of wild flowers in it, rolled it up and kind of cooked it and and then made, you know, this beautiful new piece. It was pretty, you know, incredibly inventive.

Yeah. Thank you. Yeah, I love crafting. I feel like crafting is a great pathway to get into environmentalism. And again, like, I really want to make it fun. I don’t want to tell people like, you suck. You’re a part of the problem. Blah, blah, blah. I just would be like, hey, look, here’s some wildflowers. Roll it up. Magic can happen. Nature is magical. Donate to this organization. So trying to have like a pathway that can inspire people, but also make them feel like, okay, sustainability can be fun as well.

Yeah, I saw a few posts about hope and keeping keeping that spirit alive and hope through actual action, and that we are powerful and that we can do things that are valuable and and as opposed to despair, and it’s important to stay out of despair. And I was just recently told by somebody that despair in in Catholicism is a sin. And I was like, Oh, that’s interesting, you know, like, you know, it’s kind of like we have a choice to get out of despair. We have a choice. We have a choice to do something, take some action, and to be empowered versus just complaining about everything.

I love that I also my minor was comparative world religions, and that’s a story that I’m also interested in telling I feel like there are a lot of spiritual and religious folks that really deeply care about the planet, so thank you for that quote. I’m going to look into that a little bit more and maybe make a video about that or something.

One of the things that I noticed was that you were a fan of Jane Goodall. What What inspired you about Jane Goodall?

Yeah, I feel so blessed that I was able to meet Jane twice in the last year. And what a rock star like my last the last time I saw her, she actually came to Pasadena and spoke at a high school, and there were so many families that were impacted by the wildfires and the fact that she took her time to come out, spread joy, speak to the students. She was even like cracking jokes on stage. She was very funny. She was just so cool.

And I feel like she really taught me, especially as kind of a shy, more reserved woman, that you can be reserved and still be powerful. And I think she kind of, I never really thought of Jane Goodall as an activist, but I really feel like she was, her team is also incredible, and the people she’s been able to take along the journey and just showing what it looks like when a woman takes up space in the environmental world, yeah, just what An incredible soul.

And definitely inspired me to think about environmental communications as a career. I think without her work, I don’t know, I feel like the field of environmentalism would look so different, and yeah, I think I just want to try my absolute best to continue on her legacy and her work. She had a really great organization called Roots and Shoots, which was a children’s educational program, so looking at ways to get involved with them. But yeah, I just feel really grateful that I was able to meet her this year.

Yeah, she’s such an iconic figure. I mean, I recall as a kid, you know, over 50 years ago, seeing her on PBS or whatever, with, you know, her work with primates and stuff like this, and she was, she was a force to be reckoned with. And as you said, kind of that quiet and strong model. You don’t have to be shouting in order to be powerful. And she’s such a, she was such a great example of that. That’s crazy.

I mean, I felt like she was one of those people who would be immortal and live forever. But the fact that, like, I can say that my parents can say that, and even my grandparents would be like, Oh yeah, I remember when Jane Goodall was on the air, it just shows her impact is generational. And yeah, she’ll be very, very missed.

Well, I think it goes to show that somebody who stands up for their beliefs and just takes a stand, and she was like, in some ways, an ordinary person doing extraordinary things. And that’s, I think, what we’re called upon to do, is stand up. And as I’ve heard said, sometimes the most difficult thing is to stand and see what our power is. And versus, kind of the opposite is we run from it and say, I can’t really do anything. I’m just one little person. You know? What does it matter? Versus, like, Hey, I could go out and hang out in Africa and hang with the great apes and, like, protect them. And like, I’m sure a lot of people said You are crazy. Jane Goodall, what do you think you’re doing?

Absolutely and, yeah, I think there’s so many conversations in the environmental space about, like, individual action versus systems change. And like, pitting those. Do things against each other. And I feel like you saying that is reminding me, like, yeah, as an individual, if you have some crazy belief about how you want to save the world, maybe give it a try, even if people are like, Okay, you want to go to Africa and like, hang out with prayer meets, okay, but yeah, I hope people explore their individual passions and like, apply that to the movements that they care about, and then I feel like community will come from there. So there, I don’t think there is ever any true like only individual action, even if you think it is because you might be setting an example for a friend or family to then do that same thing and it causes a ripple effect. So I don’t like when people pit individual action against systems change, because I think they go hand in hand.

Well, as a friend said recently on the podcast, well, Rosa Parks refusing to get out of her bus seat. Look like an individual action, but it sparked an enormous movement so individual. It all starts with individual action.

You’re giving me so many talking points from this podcast that was so good. Thank you.

So tell us about your podcast As She Rises.

Yeah, so As She Rises, I had the honor of posting the last few seasons. Season Four is probably my favorite. I’m a little biased, but it’s all about rewilding, which is why I really like it. There’s only three episodes all about how people have successfully rewilded or restored their Nash, their natural environment. One of the episodes I really like is about the Billion Oyster Project in New York, and the fact that they’re like putting a bunch of oysters into the sea to help clean it up.

It’s so fun. There’s another episode about agroforestry, and I just have learned so much through the podcast. It really highlights women. Each episode also features a poet. So it’s just such a fun project. And I again, feel so honored to be able to host it. And I think the latest season is our best season because it’s very optimistic, and I think we need that sometimes, like success stories of rewilding and restoring the land, and it’s just, yeah, such an honor. Season three, I also really enjoyed it.

It focused a lot on indigenous land stewardship and water and things like that. And, yeah, shameless plug. Check it out As She Rises. It’s great because of the writers. It’s amazing because of the writers and the researchers. And I’m just grateful to be able to, you know, say a couple words on the podcast.

Well, that’s fantastic. And great work in, you know, putting it together with those folks, because none of it happens kind of just by ourselves alone. It may start with one person, but it usually spreads to more people. So tell us a little bit about some of the things that you’ve done in intersectional environmentalism. I saw you had a post about a interesting exhibition at descanso gardens, the roots of cool. Tell us a little bit about that and how that’s important.

Yeah, I will say descanso is one of my favorite gardens. Also Arlington gardens. Shout out to them, people over in Pasadena area. But yeah, it’s just been really fun lately, after starting intersectional environmentalist as an organization, just being able to meet and work with and collaborate with other people that have an intersectional approach to environmentalism, and I honestly would say most people do, whether they know it or not, because I feel like we all take bits and pieces of our identity and kind of infuse it into the work that we do.

So lately, something that I am interested in, like we’re kind of talking about earlier, is getting in touch with religious communities that also want to activate for the planet. I grew up religious.

I’m not necessarily anymore, but I don’t know. I heard a quote by Dolly Parton, who’s one of my favorite people in the world. And again, another person I Hope is alive forever. But Dolly Parton was talking about why we all need to protect the earth because it’s one of God’s creations. And I thought that was like the cutest quote in the world. So really, wanting to explore climate friendly churches and things like that. The environmental justice movement in the 60s began in the church, and so did the civil rights movement. So I feel like I personally want to get in touch with, you know, my own spiritual practice, which is probably largely informed by the environment.

So that’s what’s next for me. And I also am spending time learning about eco feminism. That’s what my next book is going to be about, and how women are treated, and how the planet is treated, and how those things might mirror each other, sometimes, especially with the current climate, there’s a lot of talks about both of those things. So I’ve been having a lot of fun exploring mythology and folklore and learn. About women in the planet and things like that.

So all sounds fascinating. One of the things that you talked about like stewardship, and it is a concept that I think came out of the Bible, and it seems to be kind of a little bit of Lost Art in in our dialog and or it certainly has been overwhelmed by quarterly profits and all gross national product and things like that have taken precedence over stewardship.

And one of the things that I’ve been thinking about more is kind of this rights of nature, and that a number of places around the planet and some even in the US, are giving rights to nature, like rights to rivers and rights to oceans and mountains and things like that. And I’m curious as to if you’ve kind of started to touch on that in any of the work that you’re doing.

Honestly, I haven’t yet, but I’d love to look into that a little bit more. I’ve seen some court cases, maybe not here, maybe in Australia, where certain mountains have personhood, or rivers have personhood, and like what that looks like exactly, but I’d love to learn more, but I haven’t really gotten to researching that as much yet.

Yeah, it’s just something that I was talking to a couple people about recently, and had kind of caught my eyes to making the environmental movement a bit more fun and exciting, and that’s kind of like a fun, exciting thing is like, really, just shift the paradigm, and we have we give rights of personhood to ships and to pieces of paper called corporations. Why? Why shouldn’t a mountain or an ocean have as much rights as a piece of paper or ship. Wow.

I hope they chop that up into a sound bite, because I agree.

You were featured on the Forbes 30 under 30 and 2024, and the time 100 next in 2022, and Ebony Power 100. You have lots of heady nominations and awards. This is how does that affect you? Give you more access to, you know, people who are out there in the world influencing conversations as it opened some doors for you.

Yeah, I think, hmm. I mean, I feel really grateful for all of those things. I think it helps at times when I don’t know, I would say the biggest privilege of maybe those things, or when I want to start other projects that maybe people be like, Why are you doing this? Like craft club, I started a Crafting Club in the last year. I feel like those sorts of things earlier in my career have helped empower me to get to a position where I can do things that feel a little bit more closely in alignment with who I really am, and how I want to show up with creativity and the environment.

So I will say having those specific accolades, maybe earlier in my career, again, does feel like a privilege, which has now allowed me to do other things that feel a little bit true to where I am right now, like with craft club, or other things like we’ve been talking about. But, um, I don’t know if anything, and maybe this will change as I get older. It feels silly sometimes, because again, I started, I started working my first book at 25 and again, it still feels like such an immense privilege, and when I think about myself at that age and all the things that I didn’t know and some of the things that I didn’t know.

Now it’s a weird it’s a weird feeling, but I feel really thankful, and I’m also thankful for that time of like, it wasn’t teenage angst, but mid 20s angst. And I sometimes just want to hold my younger self and give her a hug or something like that, because I think that passion allowed me to do a lot of things. But now I look back at that time and I’m like, wow, I really had a lot to say, and I’m glad that I could say it. And I said it, so now I’m going to do some crafts and stuff.

Well, that’s great and, and great that you’re kind of using it as a stepping stone to the next bit of your story, and and wherever that might lead, versus feeling like it’s cramping you to just do X or Y and and I think you know, Springboarding to something that you feel is even more in line with where you want to go. Is, is is fantastic. So I. Kudos to you. Now in your book the intersectional environmentalist, you argue, can’t save the planet without dismantling systems of oppression, what does that look like for you? For policymakers, nonprofits and everyday people?

I would say one thing that I’ve been noodling on a lot lately is the idea of, I guess, climate reparations. So for example, for indigenous communities all around the world that might exist on kind of small island nations, and then, you know, they might have a loss of land, or that island might not be there anymore because of climate change. I’ve been thinking about, Okay, well, how can other countries support people monetarily, especially in this current age that we’re in where there’s really hostile sentiments towards the migration of people all around the world?

So I’ve been thinking about that lately, like, how can we advocate for climate refugees, or people who might lose their entire island nation, even though they haven’t really played a major role at all and climate change or with emissions, etc. So I’ve been thinking about things like that and wanting to do as much research as I can, but that’s definitely a topic I’ve been kind of focusing on lately, or maybe having a more global perspective, especially because things in the US are a bit complicated right now.

What about COP30? Did that? You know? What’s your takeaway from that, and kind of the issues you were just talking about?

Yeah, I would say I didn’t end up going to COP this year, but I know there was a group of indigenous peoples who essentially stormed the cop and were kind of demanding more of a seat at the table. And I think it’s interesting, because if you were to ask me this question in 2020 it seemed like everybody was trying to be anti racist at that time and reading like every possible book that they could. And I think a lot of people get it kind of, sort of now in the environmental space that indigenous peoples, or, you know, marginalized people, should have a seat at the table.

And now we’re at the next phase of not only do we need a seat at the table, we need to make sure that people actually have a voice and decision making power. We don’t just want, you know, to have the people’s cop or an indigenous cop, but not allowing people to speak their truth, or not having any really like binding agreements at the end of cop that actually stick. So that’s what I’ve been noodling on.

So what does the truly intersectional climate policy agenda look like at the federal or local, state level, and what’s missing from the typical green conversation?

I would say, making sure that, or maybe we could even define it globally or federally, just like, what are environmental human rights? And maybe calling them that environmental human rights like making sure that these are also things that are enforced, and this is the stat is at least 10 years old, but so take this with a grain of salt. I need to get another one. But 71% of African African Americans lived in counties that frequently violated federal air quality standards. So even white Americans was around 40% or so.

So a lot of people are living in counties that are frequently violating air quality standards. So I think we actually need to define what our environmental human rights that everybody should have. And I think that should be like I’ve kind of said it earlier, like making sure everybody has clean air, clean water, and a safe and healthy living environment and access to organic produce and things like that.

So in order for that to happen, we need to define what environmental human rights are, and then also make sure that they’re being equally enforced across the country, regardless of someone’s, you know, socio economic status, race, whether they live in a rural community, urban community, etc. So that’s what I think, like an intersectional environmental movement would look like if it were successful. And I feel like that shouldn’t be controversial, but sometimes it is.

It seems the current constitution of the federal government kind of unlikely that that’s going to happen in the next year or so. What? What about the state governments? In particular California? How would you score California on kind of environmental, human rights and things of that nature?

Well, definitely better than some places, but not amazing. I think we have so much space where we could grow a lot more food. So even in urban environments, I feel like we need to have more fruit bearing trees. We are California, after all. So I think that’s something I would like to see change, like more community fridges and things like that. There’s one down the street from me, and it’s just so lovely to. See residents get together to support one another. And I think, you know, the wildfires were horrendous, and probably the scariest thing that I’ve lived through in Southern California.

But I think it did show that we can have each other’s backs, like the fact that food banks were so piled up they had to turn away donations at one point, it showed that Californians and so called So Cal residents in particular, like are waiting for an opportunity to get active and take care of each other. And it made me realize, as a state, I really do think we can care for each other better, even if we don’t have the support of the federal government.

So I think one thing I’d love the state to focus on is really just food equity and making sure that everybody has access to some of the amazing produce that we already grow, that sometimes goes to other places in the country, but just to make sure people are fed, we get more trees and things like that so people don’t struggle as much with air pollution or, you know, lack of tree coverage. And then hopefully the biggest one is really improving our public transportation, and I know they’re maybe exploring that when it comes to the Olympics, but I think us having better public transportation will also hopefully help to help decrease pollution, like air pollution and things like that.

Well, I’m definitely a huge proponent of more people getting or basically everybody should have their hands on organic food. And I tend to think that a lot of our health problems are caused by all the crappy food that is in our systems and in our supermarkets and feeding our kids. And to me, that’s probably one of the top three investments that we could make, if not the top one, in terms of improving our food quality and making sure that we’re not putting toxics, toxins into our systems. Of course, it doesn’t, you know, it’s, it’s interesting that it’s kind of taken center stage in the mandami campaign. We’ll see how it plays out in real life, and whether or not that he’s able to effectuate a workable solution on the ground.

Yeah, and it’s interesting, I don’t know. I feel like sometimes in America, we do forget that other ways are possible, and that’s something that I want to research for an upcoming Instagram post. And like, we could have more affordable healthcare, or we could have regulations that make it so our food doesn’t have all these horrible additives. And like, Here are examples of countries that have done it successfully.

So yeah, it is really interesting when someone comes along and they want there to be free busses in New York, and hopefully that will inspire conversations all around the country. And if it doesn’t happen, well, I think it’s going to happen, but, um, yeah, hopefully it’ll just inspire the dialog for people to think outside of the box and know that the systems that we have don’t have to stay like this.

Yeah, essentially we, you know, there’s a lack of creativity in in, you know, most systems, because it’s like, oh, this the way that we did it. So we just keep doing it, the way that we did it, even if it’s not producing a great result, it’s just like, well, this is what we do. So for someone who’s maybe listening for the first time to this podcast or to anything who’s never gone to a protest, never called their representative. What’s one action you’d love them to take in the next 24 hours?

I would say, find their local environmental organization. Big shout out, if it’s an environmental justice org, think about your city. I live in glassville Park, California, so just type in your city, glassel Park, environmental justice organization, and just know their name. Like, if that’s where we’re starting, like, know their name. If you want to take it a step further, sign up for their you know, mailing list or follow them on social media, because they will definitely email you and let you know when they might need help. So I would really say, start as local as possible.

Also look up your local community garden, if you’d like, and just really do some research and get familiar with the specific environmental issues that are happening in your area, because I think that’ll make you feel even more empowered because, for example, the community garden that’s right by my house was made possible. Unfortunately, this area sometimes struggles with food insecurity, and in the past, really struggled with like gang violence and things like that.

And there’s a community garden here that was built essentially on top of a former gang headquarters, but it’s been beautiful to see how the city is kind of saying like, no, we want to have each other’s back. We want to feed each other, and we want the legacy of this town to be better, and saying that that’s possible because of all the amazing you know, community members. So I would say everybody kind of like, learn the history of your neighborhood. It and get involved with your local environmental org.

That’s great. You’ve shared tips like shopping locally, repairing, reusing and ditching single use plastics. If someone wants to start this week, what are two or three simple shifts that you’d recommend?

I would say, learn how to sew, if you can. That’s something that I started doing at the start of the year. I took some sewing classes. It just makes life more fun, and you also don’t have to waste as much, and you can hold on to your things for a really long time, and you can mend things for your friends and family or kids. And I would say, learn a skill like, you know, you don’t have to learn everything like I tried to do at the start of the year. But, you know, even bread making, I make my own plant based milks.

I save so much money. I’m going to maybe do some sort of calculation, but once you start, it just gets so much easier. Like, why would I spend $8 on oat milk when I can make it at home? And oats are so cheap. So if anything, I would say, learn how to make something so and Skillshare with your friends as well, because it’s not all on you, like one of your friends is probably an amazing knitter, and maybe you can support them, and in exchange, you can give them, like plant based milk or something like that. So try to create, like a barter economy with your friends.

That is very cool. As we head into the holidays, what are some of the earth friendly gifts or celebration ideas that align with intersectional environmental values?

That is a great question, and also putting some pressure on me, because I said I want to make 50 boxes for my closest friends and family. I know that’s a lot of people, but I’m going to have a completely handmade Christmas for all my friends where they’ll have, like, a candle, homemade lip balm, ceramic goods, or something that I make.

So this is the first year that I’m doing that. And I encourage anyone listening to maybe explore making something. And then if you don’t have time to make something, try to support a local artisan. So whether that’s going to, you know, a local flea market, local thrift store, a local artisan store, try to shop locally this Christmas if you can, or this holiday season.

All great ideas. Thank you for sharing all that. Any final thoughts that you have before we wrap it up. But you know, it’s been great having you on the program, Leah, and you know, shout out to all the work that you’re doing in the community.

Thank you. And I would say last, but certainly not least, check out As She Rises. It’s really such a fun, quick listen. And I really appreciate being on this podcast. And yeah, I would say I want people to be a lot kinder to themselves, because I think it starts internally. When you’re kinder to yourself, you’re kinder to your community, and then you end up being kinder to the planet. So I think we really need to focus on self sustainability as well.

We’re living through such stressful times with so many headlines that feel like the world is on fire every single day. So I really want people to prioritize self sustainability as well. When I think about my ancestors that lived through so many atrocities in the United States, they always had a strong belief, whether it was in church and community. My great grandma was a dancer. She was always dancing. She was at every possible party she could be at until she passed away.

So I want to live in their example, and I want to make sure people do that as well, because I think kind of succumbing to sadness and overwhelm is like letting these not so great systems win and making sure that we treat joy as a part of our activism and how we show up and resist.

I love that and self care and joy. It’s kind of, in my mind, the first place to start and then be of service, like we’ve got to take care of ourselves, and then we can help somebody else with the oxygen mask when we’re in good shape. So thank you so much. Leah Thomas for joining us.

Everybody should check out As She Rises, wherever they get their podcast, as well as follow Leah on Instagram at Green Girl, Leah and you know also go out and check out her book, The Intersectional Environmentalist, and keep your eyes out for Earth as Mother, the new book coming in 2027 so again. Thank you so much. Leah, great conversation, and love to hear about all the work that you’re doing in the community.

Thank you so much.

To learn more about our work at A Climate change and how you can help us reach our goal planting 30,000 trees in the Amazon this year, visit aclimatechange.com. Don’t forget to subscribe to our podcast on Apple, Spotify, YouTube, or wherever you get your podcasts. If you like this episode, please share it with a friend. See you next time.